Suboxone Abuse (Page 9)

My son has been on suboxone for over 1 year now. He was a herion addict for over 12 years. Been clean off and on during that time. I have seen a personality change in him which is almost intolerable. It is like he is fine one minute and then goes off the wall the next. Has anyone who has been on suboxon or knows someone who has been seen a personality change.

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The whole thing is SAD that Dr.'s are compromising their integrity to keep patients on Suboxone because it is such good money in their pocket. They get a kick-back from every Rx their write from the Drug Company, then their is the monthly appointment fee and then the Co-pay or added costs that they apply to Suboxone patients. Some will charge up to $600.00 cash before you can make your first appointment. All this is just money to the Dr.'s. Suboxone is not meant to be taken for more than 14 to 20 max. that is it!!! Or you will have to go through another detox coming off the Suboxone. The double whammy is that you are not only coming off an opiate, but an antagonist as well. I wish I never would have taken Suboxone. This man-maid drug stays in your system for a long time..which means a long and drawn out withdrawal. My suggestion..do your research, not just on-line..on-line is unreliable at times. Go into top Medical Journals on drug addiction and dependency..opiates and withdrawals. You will find the answers to your questions, maybe not what you want to here, but I am all about the truth. I am on day 32 and it dose slowly get better. I drink lots of fluids, I exercise every day, I am off all psych drugs, because they do contribute to the mess in your head-this is a very controversial statement, but until I went off everything, I was still dependent on something. Never believed that until I did it and believe me, I took Prozac for 24 years. I do Yoga every day and try to stay still for Meditation. I take only natural sleep aids-Melatonin, sleepytime tea and Valerian Root. I hit my bottom this time and when you do that, the only way is up!!! Good luck to anyone who is struggling with this issue, my heart dose go out to you, it isn't easy....but it's worth it to be clean and free..I already feel less depressed and I am still detoxing..

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I have to agree with you, I think if we make it more difficult to continue the use of Heroin .
If it's time to get clean...tough it out and maybe relapse may be thought about more seriously. If one does not want to go through the pain of withdrawal maybe one shall not strt the addiction again.

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Apparently you have never had a problem with addiction! If you don't know DON'T comment! Fool!

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I am not a fool and you have NO idea if I have had a problem with addiction. Oh hey and I am also allowed to comment.

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Go ahead and reply but I would bet my life on it that your NOT an addict or anyone who has ever struggled with addiction! It is a tough road and not everyone walked out to the local dealer and purchased drugs, some like me had 4 back surgeries and the addiction took over my life. It wasn't intentional! I blame no one but myself but people who post things saying to just stop don't realize that is not an option. So if you want to post I suggest you try to understand the disease first!

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I was addicted to 80mg Oxy's, Morphine patches, Norco's, whatever I could get my hands on, for over three years. I was injecting about $100 worth of Heroin a day when I decided id had enough. I used Suboxone for the first three days and I had a sneeking suspicion I was only prolonging the inevitable, so I quit using them. The withdrawls were extremely intense, but I was determined and pulled thru it. 14 days from my last use, I finally felt somewhat normal again. My point is YOU PLAY, YOU PAY! Im sick of people crying that they cant handle the withdrawls! You won't die from withdrawls! Everyones always looking for a quick fix. Like weight loss pills, if youve been fatting off for years a pill isnt going to magically melt off the pounds. If youve been abusing drugs for years a pill wont magically make it so you never have to suffer withdrawls. Ive been drug free for over 3 years now. Never went to rehab or a meeting, and ive never relapsed. Find your inner strength!

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That's great that you found as you put it "The inner strength" to get clean and I'm truly happy for you. You should keep in mind though that your habit wasn't exactly extreme and you were only an addict for 3 years. I was an addict for 35 years....shot dope at 15 and never stopped. I was taking 450mg of methadone daily at the end of my addiction and I can tell you this. I know for a fact the SUBOXONE saved my life and there is no doubt in my mind I'd be dead had it not been available when I finally decided I'd had enough. So when you give advice try to keep in mind that everybody is different. Different chemistry and different circumstances. I don't plan on being a lifer on suboxone but I know this. NOTHING is worse than a methadone kick....except benzos and you're lucky you got out of the game before you ever had to experience either. Good luck and stay clean.

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STOP BLAMING THE CURE, people! I had a horriffic pain pill addiction for 20 years....3 rehabs, hundreds of thousands of meetings....and I COULD NOT STOP until I started Suboxone. I have not had a pill in 3 years and my doseage of Suboxone has only LOWERED. I'm a lifer. The minute I stop Suboxone I will go RIGHT back to looking for pills. Addicted to Suboxone my A**. I've never felt better and will take Suboxone til I die.

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Is your son talking to a professional? Being an addict for 12 years, your son has other issues other than addiction. For those 12 years your on DID NOT GROW on an emotional level. Feelings/emotions that are "normal" for non addicts are NOT for him. They have been numbed for 12 years and haven't been used. Now, he is "feeling" things that he hasn't in 12 years and doesn't know how to deal with it. I can only speak for myself. I was an addict for 35 years and after getting clean I had many issues to deal with. Feelings that are "normal" for non-addicts on a day to day basis were brand new to me and I needed help learning how to LIVE!! That was the hardest part. I still deal with it after 5 years clean. I took my first shot of heroin at 15 years old and didn't stop until I was 49. All cases are different....as are people but I can tell you this. Emotionally an active addict DOES NOT deal with emotions the way a non-addict does. There is a lot more to getting clean than just quitting the drugs. Trust me on that.

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Did you read my reply to your post??

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Well I have been researching plenty about addiction and ways to get off it. It is very hard to understand and everyone is different. I myself do feel a bit of a hypocrite as I sit and read these posts and after what I said. ( quit without depending on anything else ) . That being said , I am currently taking Champix for quitting smoking. So I do apologize for my comment. Cause I know I can't just quit...I have tried.
I am researching suboxone because my daughter is a heroin addict. I went with her and we got her started on this treatment. Unfortunately, I just found out she is selling them for Heroin. This is a very difficult situation to deal with. I watch my daughter , and it is so upsetting to see what she has done to herself. She still does not admit she needs help ( mom , I am not addicted I just need to use so I don't get sick ) . It is very hard watching what she is doing to herself and her family. We have somewhere for her to go to get help lined up , she refuses and help and gets furious when we even suggests she needs the help. She does not inject she smokes and snorts. She is also using cocaine. We just moved her in with her sister, but she can not stay there. We did it because she started the suboxone . But we need to get her out of the house as she has become very abusive. She is 29 years old and has lost everything. It is a struggle for everyone. I am scared if she takes methadone or suboxone she will never be free from drugs.
Once again I apologize for my thoughts.

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i have been sitting here reading and reading and smiling & either agreeing or disagreeing and finally friendofgrandma i feel total relief to have read your post, because your post is my post, too...i can't and won't deny it - i tried tapering down and after starting at 20 mgs october 2010 i am at 10 mgs....i was at 8 mgs for a few months but all in my head or not, i was thinking about full opiates more & more frequently, and just adding another 2 mgs took the thoughts away, and that was over 6 months ago and i have stayed at 10 mgs since then...i am lucky to have my insurance cover my prescription i pay my $10 brand name copay, but i do pay the doctor every month, he won't take my insurance...but i do work full time, it's just me myself and i in this life, and working 50 hours a week sucks but it's afforded me a decent life and when i do my budget that monthly doctor visit gets included right along with the electric bill, rent, cable, car insurance and groceries, because without the suboxen, i am only TOO sure within a matter of a year or less, the other bills will not be getting paid and eventually i will lose my home because the drugs will take everything from me, so it's the lesser of the evils, and though i have never said i am a lifer, i can say i am on it indefinitely and am ok with it most days, so i try to stay away from the negative remarks, they sting a little because i'm a big girl, 42 years old, on february 24 i will be sober off of alcohol 7 years, and i drank every day for over 20 years, the pills were harder for me, without suboxen, even if i were clean, i would be thinking about the pills, and no crappy antidepressant was ever able to get that thought out of my head...i know the people who say will power and tough it out with the withdrawals are completely correct, but it's just not feasible for me at this time in my life...i have no close confidantes, my employer of 4 years does not know this about me, and i would never be able to work 9 hours a day, 5 days a week, if i am going through the hell that would become my life as a taperer....the couple times i had days where i took just one pill were days of anxiety & dread...i know u have to do it slow slow slow little by little, but it will smack u in the a** when that half life catches up, and that's when i'd end up losing my job, plus it's just me, and even on good days, i don't get it all done. i am ok with taking the suboxen and if that makes me a half asser who couldn't go all the way, so be it, i'll take this any day over the life i had september 2010 - wasn't even getting high anymore, pissing all my money away to maintain, and that is as sad as it gets for me...i agree with the lady who referred to suboxen as an antidepressant that actually works...for the most part, i feel the same exact way...i just feel normal, and that's about the best i can hope for!

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All I know is my story of addiction. My first round of addiction was with food, I was a Bulimic/Anorexic for 11 years. After a lot of work and many relapses, by the grace of God I over came this. I felt that I was in a good place in life-going back to school, single parent-happy. Then I met an abusive man who slowly creep his way into my life. I never grew up in an abusive household, so I knew it was wrong and strange his outbursts, but he was so good at explaining it away and there it began. The severity and frequency were far between at first, but the stress of it started to erode my self-worth. I started getting sick and my body started failing me, with an ACL repair and then HIP replacement, then a neck fusion, then the other hip started going. Basically I was on/off pain killers for a long time and started noticing that they numbed the emotional pain as well. As the years went on and a failed attempt at leaving him, my addiction grew. It was when I went to a pain management Dr. when things took on a new life. The Dr. put me on Fentenal a person who is use to taking Hydrocodone on Fentenal. I became instantly addicted and attempted to get off it myself and almost ended up in the Hospital. At this time, my back was giving me problems so sever I couldn't walk at times. Several back procedures later and getting off Opana-not fun, I ended up on Suboxone. The Dr. raved about it and said, "you could be on this for a long time, if you wanted". By this time, I was so messed up emotionally, the abuse was progressing, my children were suffering-the more I tried to help them, the more sever the attacks on me became. I started shop lifting because he controlled all the money and asking him for grocery money was a humbling experience..I isolated and pushed everyone I loved away and no one believed me about my home situation. I felt abandoned and hopeless. I became suicidal and then I had a God moment. I started researching Suboxone and found out that it is one of the worst drugs out there to be on long term. Further it is very very difficult to get off of and for me being 54, it was pure hell. But I had a belief that life is more than looking forward to taking that strip and feeling somewhat "normal", but never too good. I feel for everyone that has been on Suboxone for any length of time, it compromises your entire mind and body. And I know, that when you are ready, if I can do it, anyone can do it. For some, it just might be the best way. For me, I found myself drowning emotionally and spiritually. I am 106 day clean and still have some fatigue, but I am feeling now and I actually felt a real scene of joy the other day! I pray for each and everyone of you to find your right path..no judgements here, everyone has a right to their own life.

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What is your mom's age? If she is in 40-50's she may, on top of her addictions, be going through menopause. I think moms should be open with their husband and children about any meds they are on - dosage, timing of day to take, etc. It's helpful all around if there is open-eyed ingestion of meds in a household, even if it is an illegal substance.

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Zlovergrl, r u still around. Im on day 4 of the subs and feel exactly as u do. Best I've felt in years, no depression etc. What am I to look forward to down the road. My desire is quite strong. Taking subs with an intense outpatient program. As god is my witness I told the leader today im afraid this seems to easy. Thx for the tips

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Danielle,

I just posted in response to the girl regarding better than any anti-depressants. As stated I felt better than I had in years. I've been on subs for 4the days now and I am truly shocked at the lack of cravings. I've gone cold turkey many many times with some success however the lethargy & depression always brought me back. The ones that run this particular program assure me the tapering will be minimal as their words a "hickup" the paid the of withdrawal isn't so much my concern but rather the lack of energy and the depression always scare me. Any advice??

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Danielle,

I just posted in response to the girl regarding better than any anti-depressants. As stated I felt better than I had in years. I've been on subs for 4the days now and I am truly shocked at the lack of cravings. I've gone cold turkey many many times with some success however the lethargy & depression always brought me back. The ones that run this particular program assure me the tapering will be minimal as their words a "hickup" the paid the of withdrawal isn't so much my concern but rather the lack of energy and the depression always scare me. Any advice??

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I was shooting heroin, went to detox for 5 days, was on Suboxone 8mg twice a day for 1 1/2 months, then went back to dope for about 3 weeks, now back on Subs for the last 2 1/2 months. The Subs really helped getting off dope, the second time I got back on them was easy. I waited 24 hours after my last shot, took Subs all day, and was through it. But now I'm getting side effects.

My feet and lower legs are swelling up, where you can push down on the tops of my feet and leave indentations. Also nausea, vomiting for the last two nights. I do not feel held and have discussed the fact with my counselor and mother that I am planning my next use, and I would rather not but I need some kind of relief. I am getting intense pain in my neck and shoulder, which is partly due to a past injury. For the first month or so the Subs really helped with pain, but not anymore. I figure if I am feeling s***ty like this all the time, why not get back on dope?

I can't take it anymore, I am seeing my Dr. on Wednesday to discuss other options. Possibly methadone. I am trying to make a case for slow-release oral morphine, seeing as how if I were maintained on this, the side-effect profile is "more attractive" and tapering off of low-dose morphine should be a lot easier than getting off of Subs or methadone. I've heard that morphine will hold you better than the other two, I'm sure of it, I just do not know the legality of this. I am not sure if my Dr. can prescribe MS Contin, or whatever, for this purpose, opiate maintenance therapy.

The thing is I am getting my Suboxone for FREE. I have no insurance, so I enrolled in a few programs, now my Dr. and counselor visits are $7. The company that makes Suboxone, Reckitt Benckiser, has a program called Here to Help, and that is how I am getting free Subs. Check it out. It is a new program, and limited in numbers that are accepted, so act fast I guess. This is one of the problems, I don't want to switch to methadone or morphine and start having to pay up the pooper for it like I had to the first month ($450 for 1 month of Sub). But the side effects I am experiencing with the Subs, and the fact I do not feel "held", means I may have to seek an alternative. I don't want to go back to shooting dope, but honestly I think heroin is better for me than buprenorphine. The pharm company lied about the inclusion of naloxone as well, they added it to get the FDA to approve over other bupe formulations. I have shot up my Sub films, never more than 2mg at a time. No rush, just a warm feeling. An absolutely NO precipitated withdrawal. I put Subs up my ass a few times too. That gives better results. Point is, the binding affinity of bupe is stronger than that of naloxone. Period.

So I feel that because of the large amount of heroin I was doing, I need to seek out an alternative form of therapy because the Subs are just not doing it for me. I have never been on methadone, and have conflicting feelings about it. Any thoughts?

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Iv benn on subs for 3 yrs 32mg a day iv noticed a lot of changes in myself mood and depressed im now on them for pain mangment I have seen many addicts use subs only when they dont have there drugs so wat they do is there still addicted to that drug and when they dont haveit they use subs so they dont have to wwithdraw from there drugs so there changing one high for another its like a crutch when ur leg is good u walk on it but if u go bad u will use ur crutch to help u walk so u dnt have to sit down u need to tell his dr wat is going on so he can help him and stop this from happening he willcstill give him the subs but just watch him carefully maby even only give him 2 or 3 at a time

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I know you are struggling with pain issues, but if you talk to your doctor about the pain, he may be able to prescribe something non-narcotic that will treat the pain in a different way together with the suboxone. Some antidepressants, like cymbalta, treat depression, and also help with pain, too. Try sticking with the suboxone, though, because its easier than any other opiate to taper off, and also, because it stays in your body longer, you won't have the sudden return of pain, which causes some people to take stronger opiates. Plus, your getting a really expensive medication for free! Good luck to you, hang in there!!

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