Unfair Insane Methadone Clinic Detox (Top voted first)

I have been a patient at compdrugs methadone clinic for 5 years. Never had dirty urines. I got 1 dirty 20 days ago and they took my dose from 185mg to 100 to nothing. 3 days. Is this legal and do I have a chance of fighting it. The doc. Dr. Alvin Pelt. is god at the clinic. Any ideas on what I can do would be welcome. Hopefully i can figure somethisg out b4 I blow my head off. Anyone out there whos gone thru a methadone withdrawal understands. Thanks all.

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I flagged your response as unappropriate because no one should have to listen to the response (in this case, yours), filled with anger and completely devoid of empathy towards the person seeking help. Why are you on this forum?
First of all, it shouldn't concern you why this person's dose was above 180mg; different factors (it depends on an individual) might explain why his/her dose is relatively high (i.e. his/her metabolism, addiction history, health poblems, pain tolerance, etc). Clinics gladly raise their clients' doses, knowing they're prone to addiction, therefore ensuring numerous clients for life. Overall, clinics have an obligation to provide at least a semi-ethical, humane detox, no matter what situation led to an administative taper off the medication. MMT programs are insanely profittable businesses, hence the reason, most of the clinics nowdays are privately owned. If you have such unjustifiable rage towards this person's post, not only do you lack extensive knowledge about the ways clinics operate, but you also seem completely unaware of the dangers the rapid methadone detox poses to an individual.
Don't come to this forum if you're unwilling to listen, empathize and give productive advice. This might be the only place where people in need could turn to after already beeing mistreated and stigmatized by the medical community. And I suggest you do some research on the stringent bureaucracy, the actual prices of methadone, and finally, the yearly profits reported by methadone clinics, before you start blaming patients of these facilities.

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JasonR don't think you're holier than thou because your dose is lower! Did you know many people on HIV or HEPC drugs go to a higher dose because some of these drugs affect the methadone dose. Some people on dilantin lose 40% of the methadones potency due to the dilantin. Look it up in the PDR and in the future study before speaking

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I cant believe how folks that are in pain quite often get treated in this country. Is this gentleman okay because when old hippies like me read the despair in your words they grow concerned. Is he okay? It is wrong for these folks to attempt to run every moment of your life, making you submit to their rules and their control. It is shameful what some of the institutions put good people though every day in this country. When I read these remarks and the words like dirty appear because they wont you to know how wrong you are. We are all human beings here for gods sake and have done nothing wrong. We deserve to be treated that way as well. While there are great ones that genuinely care about the patients wellbeing they work with and thank god for them, there are always these others and prehistoric rules that are as controlling as anything you would see prison systems utilizing. They are humiliating, degrading, and hell bent on making you understand how dirty your urine is and how wrong you are similar to Winston's demise in Orwell's 1984. Two plus two finally equalled five. I pray for a huge change for the sake of anyone going down this path. Just remember that your not dirty and your not wrong and you should be fine.

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Everyone has a different metabolism and different need for length of treatment. Your self-righteous attitude is TRULY annoying. There are people on Dilantin who must take over 1,000 Mg/Day. Grow up and stop being so judgemental. It's obvious that you are pretty young. Well, at 60+ years old, I have been on methadone for over 30 years and there is NO damage discernible.

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i been through withdrawals from meth. i dint live in he states. but as far as im aware dropping ur dose is life threatening 180 is high man. seek legal advice although u prob dont feel up to searching and hanging in offices. is there someone in the program higher up u can talk to. what that doc is doing is dangerous u are a classic overdose risk. If all else fails shoot the motherf****r. afterall those doctors are just government drug dealers. best of luck my friend.

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Some people are not on methadone only to detox. My husband is on it for severe pain and the usual pain medications were destroying his liver. Many people don't know it but even high doses of Advil or Tylenol will destroy your liver and the usual pain killers contain high doses of tylenol. Give us pure pain meds that actually help and don't cause other problems to go along with the ones we already have.

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This does not sound right, something is wrong in this situation.

I suggest you contact your state methadone authority and file a complaint. Make sure you start a timeline and document it with as much info as you can remember, dates, times, names and what was said/what happened.

You need to find which agency your clinic is accredited through CARF (Commission on Accreditation Of Rehabilitation Facilties) or JCAHO (Joint Commission Accreditaion Of Hospitals Organization) and contact them to start your complaint. CARF 4891 E. Grant Road, Tucson, AZ 85712, USA, (520) 325-1044 or toll-free (888) 281-6531 voice/TTY, (520) 318-1129 fax

JCAHO (800) 994-6610 or send an email to [email protected]

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They cannot do that, they have to step you down gradually. Not only is this extremely dangerous to your health but it is illegal.

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Sorry, Genevieve. My post below (#10) was addressed to JasonR (#9) for his ridiculous comments.
Several people in the forum already addressed your questions & suggested various possible actions you could take. You should definitely file a compaint w' CARF. Also, look into consuling with patients' rights' advocates offices- consultations with them are free. The way that clinic 'detoxed' you was totally illegal, not to mention, completely f'ed up. I was on a fee detox from 180mg, and the clinic I was going to at that time (in Santa Cruz, CA) was detoxing me by 4mg per day (which i think is relatively standard). It took a bit longer than a month but it was still too fast for such a high dose. Subutex/suboxone is indeed an amazing drug (both an opiate agonist & antagonist) but unfortunately, you can't be taking more than 30mg of methadone to switch from methad to suboxone (because of the huge discrepancy in tolerance). Benzos, especially valium, really do help with anxiety, pain, insomnia, & sensory problems when you're rapidly withdrawing from methadone. You should be careful if you start taking them, since, like methadone, they're also extremely addictive, & you risk developing a cross addiction. If you choose to take valium, ativan, or klonopin, you should slowly taper off them as soon as you feel that the worst is over.
Good luck to you and hope you're well:)

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You obviously knew the program had a callback program if you have been there for two years.
My program made me sign a paper that explained the call back process and resposibility before giving any takehomes. If your program didnt do that, you can file a grievance with the program director and then the state dept of health.
If you did sign a paper acknowledging the callback I dont think there is much you can do. Really sux , but should have asked about vacation. My prog requires min 3 week notice before vacation

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Funny thin on a positive urine screen.
I've been on methadone for 6 1/2 years.
Couple years ago when I put in a request for extra take homes for a vacation. You see, me and my roommate were FLYING to Las Vegas for 13 days. At the time I only received 6 take homes at a time so I needed 7 additional. I was quickly approved for the extra take homes as I comply with all the rules at the clinic.
Here is the punch line--- when I returned from Las Vegas and went to the clinic the following day upon returning from Vegas. I went to the medication window and gave my i.d. number. The nurse promply said I would only receive that days dose in person, she said I had a dirty urine screen. She would not listen to anything i said. Until another nurse, I remember his name Doug, stepped from the next window and asked me wasnt I out of town on vacation and I said yes.
There had been a urine screen on urine that was NOT mine and could NOT have been mine, as the test results stated the urine was obtained from me in the middle of my vacation. FUNNY , I was over 2000. miles away in another city. No urine collected from me !
To this day I rub it in their faces every chance I get as they could never explain how the above happened.
If not for the other nurse taking the time to listen to me, I would have been blamed for something I did not do.

On another note, I've been over dosed 2 times at the clinic I goto. Once by twice my daily dose. I tried to tell the dosing nurse that the dosage was not right as I watched her put double in my immediate dose and double dosage in all my take home bottles. She then put the Kool Aid in each bottle, I asked again just as she got half way thru the bottles. She told me to shut up that she was right.
I took that days dose at the window which was a double dose. I left the window with 27 take homes which were doubled in dosage, ( I was on 27 take homes at that point in time)
I left the dose window and had a moment of weakness and thought to heck with it and started out the door. I turned around and went back inside. The head nurse which is at a local hospital now, she since left.
Anyway she saw me walking back in the building and asked Bob are you ok. I paused then told her no.
I told her my concern that the nurse double medicated me. She had me come back to the window I dosed at and she and the nurse that dosed me did a inventory of the windows methadone supply. A funny look came on her face ( the head nurse) she asked me for all my take homes back, They made up a new batch of 27.
By the time I got home there were over 7 or so calls from the clinic on my answering machine wanting to make sure I made it home as I was driving alone.
SO WHEN YOU DECIDE TO SLAM SOMEONE FOR A SUPPOSED DIRTY URINE SCREEN MAKE SURE YOU KNOW IT WAS A CORRECT SCREEN. NOT A FALSE POSITIVE.
There are many more times that such has happened at the clinic I attend. I have no doubt the same crap happens at other clinics.
I have had a false positive for marijuana before, then the same urine was tested again with negative results.
I have never , I repeat never use marijuana in my life.
I requested, insisted a retest on the urine in question as I know I did nothing wrong. Like I stated, it was nagative the second time around, same urine !

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Granted, Oh Great Joejoker I have only been on for 30 yrs THIS time. I too was on at Beth Israel. AT the beginning. Met with Vincent P. Dole SEVERAL times and greeted him in San Francisco on his 90th birthday since he and his life-partner Marie Nyswander have always been heroes to me: risked their licenses many times AS HUMANITARIANS to help me and even abusive jerks.

You're right. I know NOTHING. Just an AA in molecular Biology/Biochemistry in my 40s plus master-level courses in Medicinal Chemistry, etc. I followed the discoveries of mu, kappa, etc receptors as well as all the Cyt p-450 breakdown proteins. Your knowledge is as limited as your empathy, both of which seem to be driven by an overarching need for your sick ego to be stroked. So congratulations on the German car. I hope it makes up for all the terrible personality problems. good LORD you are abrasive. I'd hate to be your dog, hod, or mate, as you are probably as abusive, little man. Is there room for terrible attitudes like yours? Not in MY world nor in theirs. You are no expert- your knowledge is more limited than mine which could stand some beefing up too. Where do you get off? You pound your chest like the Great Apes.

Feel good.

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Kim: Wow...are you ever wrong. People most certainly do die from sudden withdrawal, especially if they have other health issues. And, addiction is not a disease, it is a symptom of depression or other issues. Or, people get addicted due to massive pain. In that case, addiction is an acceptable course of treatment, as it allows people who would be unable to do anyting at all, and have no quality of life, get on with what they can! Opiods/methadone can be beneficial; it's all in how they are used. One person's poison is another person's godsend. Please don't make uninfomed, blanket pronouncements like that. You do no one any good, you are wrong, and you are hurtful.

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i was on a program in CT at 210 mg . i did not want nor ask to be that high but every time i turned ina dirty urine with Cocaine,they would raise me up.. so much methadone i would be sleeping all the time. I did coke to stay awake a few hrs a day. I queationed the high dose with admin there, and they said they were trying to stabilize me.??? when i asked to reduce the dose, they refused said it was medically unadvisable. Then they proceeded to be detoxed there aver 3 months because i complained,,, put me back on the street, after two yrs i returned to the same program, the old doc was fired and they put me back on at about 100mg everything ok.. Doctors do screw up but what can you do?

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dr. pelt is God at compdrug. i think he gets off on detoxing someone who's been on methadone for years then make up a 'NEW RULE' and anything he says goes. dr. pelt is Satan in the flesh.

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Addiction to opioids IS a primary disease- it's a disordering of the relation between ligand and receptors in one of the main pain and reaction systems in our body and mind: the entire nervous system: autonomic AND voluntary. If that isn't primary disease I don't know what is.

It might START, as mine did, as a symptom of depression but after years it becomes a problem of its own

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I totally understand. I've been on methadone for 15years and I've seen everything ileagal done to my self an others. If anyone has a problem with 15years all I have to say is "I'm clean have a great family and great life.But for these clinics, someone has to do something because what they do and how they treat people is unbelievable. You are totally at there mercey and if you piss them off, they put you out.I have called every state drug e alcohol agency every NAMA and any number I could find and never got any help or situation resolved. The stuff I've seen at these clinics I won't even wright because it's even hard for me to believe.But it has to STOP. I'm am trying everything in my power to get people to take notice and put a stop to it so one day I can stop someone from getting detoxed.

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ADVOCATE-ADVOCATE-ADVOCATE- But carefully and effectively. If you feel your rights are being trampled by your clinicians, advocate first to your counselor then up the ladder. If you do so without verbally or physically threatening any of them, they cannot do anything punitive. If they DO anything punitive you have grounds for suit, but, since that is unlikely to happen, keep reporting up the ladder and KEEP RECORDS CAREFULLY- DATE, INCIDENT, REPORT, RESPONSE, NEXT REPORT AD NAUSEUM. If you cannot keep your temper (which will get you screwed every time) then get help from another patient or from the county Monitor but state your case clearly. The mechanics of all this are often impossible. This is the reason I am trying to get funding as the citywide advocate for Drug Assisted Recovery Patients, who have special needs and a special set of hurdles they must jump.

If anyone has any ideas as to where I might get a seed money grant for such a position please let me know below.

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JUST SOME INFO.,I can't believe some of the comments here. I'm an old timer. You can most certainly die from withdrawals! One of the causes can be as simple as dehydration. loosing too many fluids eventually your organs will shut down and cause death..think about it. There are Federal Guidelines for Adm. detox which clinics should adhere to but that doesn't mean they will.

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Beautiful Disaster... WRONG!! You CAN die from opiate withdrawal related complications. Posting the same asinine statements over and over is not going to make them true. Geez you are so uninformed and ignorant its sad. Not to mention you lack of empathy and understanding either makes you a TOTAL Hypocrit or a right-winger posing as a methadone patient..or both. Just shut your mouth cuz everybody here wants you to and more importantly because you are printinging inaccurate information and making light of a serious situation, not only or Genveive, but for the larger picture of the Opiod Stigma rampant in this country. If doctors cared about helping people instead of lining their pockets, they wouldnt create an addiction where none existed before, then expect people to go cold turkey off their pain meds after a surgery or other procedure. DOCTORS CREATE ADDICTS. METHADONE CLINICS REAP THE BENFTS WHILE SPITTING IN THEIR CLIENTS FACES AS THEY TAKE THEIR MONEY. ANYBODY WITH HALF A BRAIN CAN SEE WHATS GOING ON IN THIS COUNTRY AND THE FOOLS PLACING *ALL* THE BLAME ON ADDICTED PEOPLE ARE JUDGMENTAL IGNORANT....like "BEAUTIFUL DISASTER"......

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