Opioids & U.s. Senate
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U.S. Senate has succumbed/conspired with health providers to practically eliminate severe or chronic pain med for the elderly. Some 16,800 deaths of young drug mixing punks & the cost of providing these meds; has caused the low level intelligence & greedy health providers to furiously lobby (bribe) the U. S. Senate to order a 40% decrease in severe/chronic meds for the elderly; not for young drug mixing "punks" because they will mix something else. It has been shown that the Senate members have been drunk or half drunk in decisions like this. Proof of the aforesaid? here it is: the Senate ignores 1.6 millions of deaths & or severe mutilations due to alcohol. Senators have never done heavy strenuous work that by the time you are 65/70 years old, everything hurts to a more or lesser degree. If the elderly & or severely injured/impaled were allowed to obtain these meds, even at a higher cost, they would be able to live somewhat normal lives & still be productive members of society. Solution: health providers should increase the charge to patients to cover costs and anyone under 60 years of age should be scrutinized thoroughly & no one should be allowed to take more than 3 or 4 10 MG per day. I have been taking 2 a day for 16 years & consider myself an expert on the subject. Anything more than 4 10 MG a day, would categorize you as an addict, according to all expert doctors on the subject.

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w john (# 24) --

Excellent post! Truly spot on! It really is no one's business who takes what, it's between the doctor and the patient!

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Re: Shay (# 42)

That plus it does absolutely nothing for actual pain!!

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Re: Steve (# 7)

Long time use of Gabapentin will cause: Brain fog and memory loss. This drug is in Lyrica. The drug the FDA has approved for Fibromyalgia and Diabetics. Beware of this drug.

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12 months of investigative reporting & statistics from several governmental agencies; have shown without equivocation, that the opioids epidemic is a "politico economical" strategy used by the unscrupulous but powerful CEOs of several nationwide, heath providers, in conjunction with just as unscrupulous -but half drunk- members of Congress, that fanned the spread of a fabricated or exaggerated opioids epidemic. Proof of the false alarm, came out of health & other governmental agencies, that quantified the deaths attributed to "addicted" opioid users. Figures vary from 15,000 to over 20,000. BUT, all agencies, governmental or other, agree that practically all of those deaths were people under 50 years of age. Which brings us to the same conclusion: "young punks" (as people call them) are preventing us -the elderly- from taking our much needed pain killers, that allow us to live our lives in tolerable pain & still trying to be productive members of society. Our call & cry goes out to unscrupulous health providers & Congresspersons; to make adjustments on the "per pill price" so as not to cause an insurmountable burden difficult to absorb on all health providers. $1.00 or even $2.00 "per pill" could be justified, as long as we, the elderly can live in somewhat tolerable pain.

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Under the old formulation "anything more than 3 or 4 10mg per day" I could probably agree. However, the new reformulated generics are almost totally ineffective. I took the Watson brand of generic hydrocodone for almost 12 years with never a complaint. Then Watson was stopped being produced and Walgreens replaced them with the "Actavis" brand. The "Actavis" brand of hydrocodone is worthless and totally ineffective. Tylenol or Advil off the shelf is just as good. So while you may consider yourself an "expert" your information on the generics, at least, is incorrect. This is one thing I KNOW.

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Re: w john (# 37)

Again, it appears as if I am replying to my own comment and, to some degree, I guess I am. I got the Court ruling from the Administrative Judge yesterday and it was, as they put it, not favorable,. I beat every objection that that insurance company had put in my way. EXCEPT ONE. They said that I must get my Doctor to write the name brand is medically necessary. I testified that my current Doctor does not have all of my records so could not testify truthfully about my needs. They agreed that I had went through the "step therapy" that had been used as an excuse for denying my request for the name brand medication. In fact there were several things that were used to deny my request and I successfully argued them all. All except the so called requirement that my Doctor state that my request is medically necessary. That are asking my Doctor to commit perjury because my Doctor does not have my records going back over 12 years. I have had four Doctors and lived in two States since 2006. I stated that the new reformulated generics are ineffective and my Doctor said that is hard to argue because they will look at what you say as "your opinion". My Doctor cannot say that the medications that I have been taking for over 12 years are not effective because their is no proof that the new generics have been reformulated.if there were scientific analogies to prove they were reformulated then I might have an argument but without proof it is my word against theirs. In a civil case the burden of proof is "more likely than not". It is not like, in Criminal cases, "beyond a REASONABLE doubt". The stating by the Administrative Law Judge that I have to PROVE my statement is totally unreasonable and pretextual. So I am going to appeal further. The so calle "rules" have been se up in such a way as they are requiring me to prove a negative. I am going to appeal further and get this set aside if there is any way possible. Because there is a lack of proof to deny that I am telling the truth they are taking the insurance companies word for it with no proof on their side.

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Just the facts here- anyone can google opioid deaths and see the majority die from street drugs and black market fentanyl. There are some deaths from RX pain meds, but it doesn’t say if was the patient who was prescribed the meds or someone who got them on the street. There are street drugs that LOOK like RX, but have the “bathtub fentanyl” in them. All the hysteria over deaths from people willfully abusing street drugs is causing legitimate pain patients to be cut back to the point some are suffering so badly they take their own life. They don’t list those deaths separately. My first ortho surgery was at age 8. I worked so hard to be able to walk. I won’t go in a wheelchair willingly! I was handed over to pain management when the surgeons could do no more for me. I was able to take care of myself and live a good life for about 15 years. I didn’t worry about pain. I never abused my meds for the simple reason if I did I’d run out, and without pain relief life’s just not worth living. I don’t want to be a burden on my kids or anyone else. My mind is still sharp, but my body won’t cooperate. All went fine until my Dr. whom I’d trusted for years insisted I be put on an expensive fentanyl sublingual spray (600mcg 6x a day) I wanted no part of it. I’ll need pain meds the rest of my life and knew to save the strongest for when I have no other choice. The generic pills I took worked fine. I was told I had to take the SubSys or nothing! Blackmail! I moved to a small town with a new pain Dr. and after some awful withdrawal (I was only on that stuff 2 months!) my body finally adjusted to the minimum amount we agreed would be best.Years went by with no increase. I’d seen what taking too strong a dose could do. Nope. Not interested!
Then the cutbacks started. The news was full of opioid overdoses, drug seeking patients that lied and went to multiple Dr’s and pharmacies, some selling the meds and “pill mills” that gave narcotics to anyone with cash. Gradually my “minimum dose” that worked was cut back more and more. It took months for my body to adjust to more pain with less medication, now I’m told more cuts are coming. I’ve adjusted so far, but to lose even more when I barely made it through this last winter...I just can’t face another winter with the extra pain knowing I won’t even have the amount that wasn’t enough last winter! I’m going to enjoy this summer, but I don’t expect to make it through another winter. I’m getting my affairs in order. What’s really sad is that it’s not pain patients who are overdosing, but we pay the price. If the drug companies had name brand drugs to get rich from they’d never stand for this assault on their profits! They were caught in their SubSys scam... but now as “the good guys” they are getting rich from the drugs to treat addicts, Suboxone and Subutex. Just watch. When those go generic they’ll declare it inhumane to allow people to suffer and promote their next wonder drug. It’ll be “safe and abuse proof” just like OxyContin was.

I found out later SubSys was a scam to put patients on an expensive (thousands a month) name brand only med only approved for cancer patients! Dr’s of course were told it was safe and good for all kinds of pain, from headaches to cancer!

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Re: John (# 36)

I will give you a more detailed reply hopefully by tomorrow. Just so you will know I am in Colorado but the hearing will be held in the Kansas City, Missouri Court. Let me say briefly that I have had 3 Neurology Associates Offices state that my shoulder has an inoperable condition and they "MAY" be able to improve it but after surgery, months of rehabilitation, and an awful looking scar it may only be 10% better. They said I had three options. The surgery, shots, or, if I tolerated the pain medications okay I could just stay on that. I chose to stay on the pain medication and it was effective for over 12 years with no problems until the so called "opioid crisis" and the manufacturers attempted to reformulate and remanufacture the pain pills. Like I posted earlier, TWO pharmacists that I have known for years told me off the record to pursue the name brand Vicodin because they have had no complaint about them. They have not been reformulated and remanufactured. I will keep you posted and give more details tomorrow. It is late here and I do not have the time to post all of the details today.

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Re: w john (# 33)

Wow my friend, we are in the same boat going down the river, my river is in Sacramento, Ca., where's yours located? I had been on Qualitest Generic Norco 10/325 4 years and didn't realize how good of product it was at controlling my pain until Kaiser hospital switched to Mallinckrodt Norco Aug. 2017. 2 pills and I got sick to my stomach, host of allergic reactions got worse over next 2 weeks including withdrawals with little to no pain control and had me on meds for vomiting, lost 10 lbs. My Kaiser Doc told pharmacy to only fill RX with Qualitest Norco, they refused so I filed a complaint and they refused my Doc's request. Kaiser then also refused to provide "Brand" meds saying there were too many generic Norco's on the market although still refused to order any other Generic Norco for me, WTH. My Doc said he couldn't believe it, option then was to put me on Oxycodone/Percocet which I had to take immediately for some pain relief. I blew up telling Kaiser they don't practice what the preach, Kaiser's writings advise to take the weakest opioid possible. Told Doc Oxycodone was too strong, concerned about driving my car, he then advised my body would adjust to it, I told him that's exactly what I didn't want to happen, be more dependent on a stronger opioid than needed. I was forced to pay out of pocket for Qualitest Norco I found at a private pharmacy. Next Surgeon at Stanford said not very optimistic they could improve my shoulder but didn't think they could make it any worse. After all the B.S. above I took the risk & had the 4th surgery, no improvement, zero, none. Although to justify their procedure the report said 'pain improved', took me 7 months to get Stanford to make the report accurate, pain not improved, although damage was already done. Immediately following their report worker's come insurance company refused to pay for opioid meds. NOW my pharmacy stopped carrier Qualitest Norco and went to Tris Pharmacy Inc. Norco, not as good for pain control. New PM Doc last week ordered me Gabapentin for nerve damage/pain & to also lower my Norco/opioid intake and insurance company "refused to pay for Gabapentin", WTH, makes a lot of sense, huh. I'm now on my way to pharmacy to pay out of pocket for this product, hope it helps. If not I'm at the point to stay on Qualitest Norco if I can find and tell everyone to leave me the hell alone. I'm on SSDI & Medicare w/ Kaiser coverage & still have Workers Comp. Ins., open claim and I'M paying for pain meds with money I DON'T HAVE, crazy & wrong. A friend has had to be on Norco over 25 yrs, not organ damage. SORRY for the long writing but PLEASE let me know the outcome of your appeal hearing & State of which it is held in. Hope you are successful my friend because chronic pain is hell on earth without all this other B.S.!

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I posted my story here about a month ago, and since then I have received the medical cannabis card.
(It only took about 3 months to get due to the slow process in Illinois government)

I tried the CBD oil for pain relief and so far it has been working great!
I've cut my dosage in half with the Endocet and I should be completely off of them in another month or so.

I first tried the CBD oil from a health food store, but it did nothing and it only made me sick from the fillers they had added to it.

The "real" CBD oil from the dispensary is a lot better, and it has some THC, but not enough to really get "high" on if you use it correctly.
Besides getting great pain relief, I only get a calming affect that also helps with my anxiety, depression. STRESS, and PTSD.

They have a lot of other products to try so it might take some time to figure out what works best for my situation.
I don't like the "high" associated with the products that contain higher levels of THC and only try out the products that have the highest CBD content.
And supposedly NOT addictive!!!
I also found that I could drop one of the blood pressure medications they had me on. Apparently the CBD oil helps lower blood pressure too!
And no, I'm not a pot head! I hate the smell and taste of that, but the oils and edibles are definitely worth checking into.

I heard that the Illinois Senate passed a law allowing doctors who are prescribing their patients the opioids can now prescribe the use of medical cannabis for chronic pain? And then those patients can receive a temporary medical cannabis card for one year?
Wouldn't it be great if insurance covered that?
Maybe someday after enough people find out the real benefits from using it they'll change things.
That is if BIG PHARMA allows it!

The only downside I see with this type of treatment for pain relief is, how long will it be when they decide to say we're in a medical cannabis crisis and then ruin that for us chronic pain sufferers too?
There probably won't be a crisis though since the medical cannabis is "taxed".

Like I said before, if they could collect taxes on the opioids there would be no crisis.
If they weren't collecting taxes on the alcohol and tobacco, those products would be banned too because of the crisis they have caused with all the dangers and deaths associated with those products over many decades.
But those in power who are addicted to the MONEY allow that to continue, as long as they get their cut!

But so far, this real CBD oil has been working great!
Hopefully they will add this to health insurance benefits and lower the costs.

Remember though that the real worst crisis in this country is the "MONEY ADDICTION crisis or MONEY DRUNKS crisis"!
Think about that one for a while, and hopefully you'll see it, if you haven't already noticed it before.

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Re: Steve (# 31)

I was making a point by using "lyrica " to make a point but spell check messed me up and it came out lyrics. .

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Re: John (# 30)

This is the main reason that I was given three options on my shoulder injury. I was told by TWO different Neurological Doctors Offices that surgery would probably only partially repair my shoulder. That after having surgery, going through months of rehabilitation and being left with a big scar that my issue may only be 10% better than before surgery. I was told that I could get shots in my shoulder, OR if I tolerated the pain medications well that I could just continue to take them. With there being no guarantee that surgery could correct my issue, and with shots only being a temporary band aide I decided to continue with the pain medications. So everything was fine on the pain medications until the first of the year and my pharmacy went from a great generic to one that is totally ineffective. Then the ineffective pain pills were awful and no better than a Tylenol or Advil. I asked two Pharmacists from two different large pharmacies what the issue was and BOTH of the told me that they have received many complaints and that the generics were reformulated and have become totally ineffective. I asked them what I should do and they told me to tell my Doctor to write "No Generics" on my subsequent prescriptions (I have taken these pain medications for more than 12 years). The problem is now my insurance has refused to allow me to take the name brand and I am going through the appeal process and have a hearing with an Administrative Law Judge at the end of the month. My insurance is doing everything in their power to stop from paying for my scripts. I am not going to ramble on but believe me this is stupidity. I have them dead to right and unless this Administrative Law Judge is in the pockets of the insurance companies this unilateral ruling by the insurance company to deny me effective medication will be over turned.

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Re: Steve (# 31)

Hi Steve, I just wanted to say that you make many excellent points in your post! I agree, those who are"entitled" will get whatever they need when they need it, no questions asked, and they couldn't care less about the rest of us!

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You can bet those same senators, when in pain, get opiates regardless of the bill or bills they sign against prescribing them. They are all over 50 and probably get very little excersice. I will say a good number have chronic back or joint pain. They treat us like children. It's common practice in the U. S. If 1% of patients abuse a certain drug, the other 99 % Will pay. First they will come up with a catchy slogan "just say no" and then the brainwashing begins. I am not advocating drug abuse of any kind. I'm just pointing out the fact it is in the big pharmaceutical companies best interest to manufacture drugs that we won't overdose on but still will make us physically sick if we try to stop taking them. If we overdose and die that's one less patient spending money. These new generation drugs for pain are meant to be taken for life. Just watch a lyrics commercial, lyrics is the same as gabapentin. Through their fast talking description of the side effects that are 10 times longer than the benefits of what it's suppose to cure. Then really think about it. You won't want to take it at all. I call these drugs "placebos with addictive chemicals to keep you addicted." They work just like "Big Tobacco." Only backed up by the FDA.

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Dani (# 29) & Steve (#22) --

Not good news, just saw a PM Doc who said I have to lower Norco intake and start/add gabapentin. Haven't got the meds yet but he says my chronic pain is due to nerve trauma, I tend to agree. 4 shoulder surgeries and the 1st surgery destroyed my shoulder for life. I wouldn't take stronger opioids than Norco even though suggested by some Docs and I set the limit at 50 mgs daily [5 pills], which makes pain bearable but helping less recently, been going on 4 1/2 years. I have to agree with the PM Doc that Norco isn't working as well as it use to.

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Steve (# 22) --

Steve, I was not aware of this about gabapentin. I personally have never been prescribed this nor I have I tried it 'on my own'. I was under the impression this was a commonly prescribed drug for nerve-related pain. I have been a member in these drug forums for almost 7 years. Unfortunately for me, I switched to a different email & in re-registering with the site in 2016, all of my previous profile history is gone and I appear as a beginner here. I say this because I've answered and posed many questions over the years and have genuinely tried to help & educate through my own personal experience and education. I am a recovering alcoholic and drug addict of 12 years. It really made the hair on my arm stand up to read your comment because this describes my 76 yr old father and I know for certain he's been taking gabapentin regularly for several years now.

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John (# 23) --

Thank you, John. Sorry for my multiple posts. Just couldn't shut up I guess. I get that way when it seems I'm musunderstood. Poor me, lol. Best wishes!

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Re: JMJ (# 17)

....it WAS a great Post! Very informative and well written..

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Once again the members of the U. S. Senate have been fooled and or "bribed" by the CEOs of the major health providers. After years of research and millions of dollars spent by the pharmaceutical companies, they came up with several non-opioid, strong pain killers, so as to keep the corporations afloat, making a profit and providing the strong medications needed for chronic pains or post op needs. One of those such strong pain killers that pharmaceutical companies came up with, is called synthetic Oxicodone. But since health providers have demonized & "satanized" these powerful medications, to avoid absorbing the cost of providing them to patients, they have continued lobbying & bribing members of the Senate, to continue the propaganda about reducing production of even the non-addictive synthetic Oxicodone & others alike, the low academic population of the United States has been fooled once more & to their detriment, accept the false propaganda about these new medications & the elderly prefer to walk around hunched over & in pain, because they believe that the U. S. Senate must be trying to protect them from these horrible pills. While it is true that any opioid mixture (including the new synthetic form) with alcohol can & will have serious & or severe consequences; young "punks" will continue to use mixture of anything & everything to get the highest possible, & will continue to kill themselves at any cost. Of course a lot stronger controls are needed to keep these medications from young people.

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Re: Steve (# 7)

I’m just curious if anyone on here has tried a pain stimulator? I was denied by my insurance after I jumped threw all the bells and whistles,can’t believe all the red tape and the doctors saying they care, it’s all about money they don’t care!

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