Generic Norco M367 10/325 (Page 24)
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It's no good. I have to take three at a time for 1 hour of pain relief. Anybody else have this problem with M367 - 10/325? Has anyone else noticed that meds from certain manufacturers do not work as well for them?

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smalls,

Thank you for taking the time to write so much accurate information. You are so kind.

I also have used my search engine to get at the facts. There is so much to read.

My only unanswered question is "Can my family Doctor prescribe Norco 10 if he is willing?" He knows me and he would, but I worry he may not know about the new laws. I have never taken more than prescribed and I have never had a problem with addiction. My pain Dr is IMHO is having a meltdown. He screams at patients and his nurses and receptionists. I left his practice. because I could not take it any longer. He never cut me off of my prescription. He made me wait an hour every time and repeat needless diagnostics. It is all about money. His abusive behavior was ruining my health. He has been reported by many patients but nothing is done.

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Regarding the Mallinkort trial. I believe they were experimenting with patients that were not informed because I received my monthly rx of 10/325 Norco from Mallinkort without knowing they changed manufacturers and was at the e.r. I complained to the pharmacists and he told me they made them that way so people would not abuse these drugs. If this is the case then we have a problem people because if your supposed to take a normal pill every four hours and you take this new one there's probably a good chance of overdose if the new pill is for every 12hours that would be three times the dose at once am I reading the article correctly ?

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I think what he is trying to say is our drugs come from another country because there cheaper to manufacture. And in these other countrys some of them don't have power or good water so you never know what you are getting it depends on the kind of day there having.

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You need to take half to get it in your system after 20 minutes take the other half.then take normal also wait 20 minutes before you eat something it works better that way hope it helps

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If a pharmacist refuses to fill a valid script for Norco or any controlled substance they are to be reported to the FDA. It is illegal. Get on Google and search you will find legal cases against pharmacists who are discriminating against chronic pain patients.

Too bad they are probably not aware that they cannot send people away. it is also their duty to keep supplies in stock. Can you imagine going to a grocery store that has no food?

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Watson is no longer Watson Actavis took it over and there Norco pills are horrible I get better results from Aleve then Norco 10/325 I have to take 2 in order to even get a little relief I had a total knee replacement in April and while I was in Rehab I was getting yellow Norco I don't know where they get there supply but Walgreens deals with Actavis for Norco and like I said they do not work good

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Yes but be very careful speaking to the pharmacist about this problem. it seems it is cheaper for them to switch manufacturers and buy in bulk so they don't really care if it works for you and then they accuse you of being a addict because you are asking for a specific manufacturer. Good luck.

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I never had any issues with any of the generic hydrocodone tabs. I used most, including the one with M367. I actually liked that one. The little yellow football shaped one is dense and hard. It takes too long to dissolve. But other than that, no problems. If one has to take 3 at a time, there's a bigger problem than pill strength. The body is building up a resistance.

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Midwest,

Both Walgreens and CVS sell only Activis 853 but I looked at my pills and they are small football shaped and the pill is solid on one side and the other side says Watson 853. They were giving me Mallinckrodt before these. I ask for a different generic and they always say they only stock one kind. I do not think they are very strong.

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Wow, thanks for the explanation. It certainly gives us a lot of information. As I said before, I am required now to use the mail-order pharmacy, Express Scripts to fill all of my recurring monthly prescriptions. In doing so, my doctor gives me a 90-day prescription written indicating "Qualitest brand only, no substitutions." It has worked thus far, and I don't have to do the pharmacy shopping thing each month. I highly recommend that anyone whose insurance covers Express Scripts to use them. They mail it express overnight and I sign for it at my local post office. I know these recent changes in classes of meds is just a way for the government to further control the healthcare industry, and it will only get worse until things are changed by whomever will be in charge the next time around. It may not change enough, so people need to realize how much control the government is exerting over our healthcare and try to do what we can to police the industry and be smart consumers. I hope this helps.

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I have been prescribed Hydroco/Apap, generic for Norco and it is a joke. I take two tabs, 7.5-325, approx. every 6 hours or more and get about an hours relief. Recently I switched back to Tramadol HCL 50mg tab amn. I take one tab twice a day and get infinitely more relief than I do from Norco and it is about $8.00 for60 tabs. Also. The doctor can phone in the script and I don't need to go to his office to pick it up. I'm taking the meds because of two botched up surgeries in the neck for a pinched nerve. Thankfully I had some Tramadol for a recent knee surgery and the pharmacist assured me I can switch with no problems.

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I'm going to try to explain a few things about generics you might find useful. First: I'm not a doctor. I make mistakes. I might say something wrong or goof. Second, I am a scientist, but in computers. But I do understand the scientific method, and I can handle a little bit of statistics, and translate it into plain language. Third, I've been taking various generics since, ummm, 1980 or so, so I have some practical experience here. (Possibly more practical experience than I'd like.)

I've seen many reports of generic Norco M367 (and 365) 10/325" [e.g., 325 mg tylenol, 10 mg hydrocodone] not working well. I see them all over this forum. (Many people I've read are most unhappy with the quality control. I've seen them referred to as "garbage" and "India generic trash", which may tell you how happy people are with offshore generics).

What's needed: A list of generic manufacturers and whether or not users think their pills work. Thus I don't have a good enough database to make statistically valid conclusions, e.g., to say that something is absolutely true or absolutely false.

It may be a smart idea to start tracking this here; e.g., "DingALing Generics, India dispenses useless Norco 10/325" The more the data, the better. But that would probably be a different thread, and doing that sort of thing is up to the site operator, not me.

Also, try Googling: "Who makes hydrocodone 10/325" and get a list of manufacturers.

Going to Wikipedia and typing in "generics" will do more to educate you on this stuff than anything I could give you. But let me at least try. I'm quoting Wikipedia:

In theory, generics are "...within the range of a 90% Confidence Interval of 80.00%-125.00%...".

Stay with me here! This isn't hard math! It's just a way of saying something in "statistics shorthand". It isn't hard to understand:

It just means that 90% of the time (so, "9 times out of 10"), a generic will be in the range of 80% to 120% of what -ought- to be in the pill. So in our "Norco 10/325" example, 90% of the time, you'll get hydrocodone in the range of 8mg ("80%") up to hydrocodone 12mg ("120%").

The other 10% of the time, who knows what you'll get? Statistically speaking, which greatly reduces what can be said for certain, you have a 9 in 10 chance of getting meds within a 40% range of what they should be: (in our case, 80-120 mg). It also means that whoever came up with that range and confidence interval was not comfortable saying, "You'll always get well manufactured meds with good quality assurance". In particular that last 10% can be a real problem.

Note also that the amount of tylenol ("acetaminophen" in 10/325's) will also be in the 80% to 120% range, so (pulling out my calculator), 9 times in 10, you'll get something in the range of 260 mg up to 390 mg. For those of us who like our livers, tracking the amount of tylenol we take is important stuff.

And it's not saying that the amount won't wobble from pill to pill. One pill may be 8mg, another 10mg, another 12mg. Who knows?

It could be that when the elephant turning the generator wheel for the generic manufacturer stops for a break, that you might get a pill full of acetaminophen, hydrocodone, elephant toenails, or whatever. Many manufacturers are in the Third World. On a more serious note, you may get lead or red paint.

For Americans used to meds that generally are in the ballpark, and who are not used to third-world manufacturing practices and quality assurance, this is quite a shock. But in the 3rd world the infrastructures don't give electrical power 100% of the time, and the water isn't always clean (a la "Montezuma's Revenge"). And no matter who you blame, American healthcare is in big trouble.

In the 3rd world generic manufacturers are trying to make money. If they set their machinery to put 8 mg hydrocodone into every "10/325" they make, then out of a lot of 10 of them, it costs them 80 mg of hydrocodone to make the pills, not 100mg. That extra 20mg is "free" for them, and goes into the next batch. Multiply this by a whole lot of pills and you'll see why it's bad business for them to make pills on-spec.

(Something to watch out for: If you're buying "10/325"'s on the Internet, specifically the Dark Web, you will rapidly find out that many people are quite good at forging pills. They'll have the correct color, identical markings, and so forth. Right now the marketplace for hydrocodone is a seller's market, after our wonderful DEA kicked hydrocodone into the silliness of Schedule II, so look out for forged pills. I wish there was a lab you could send pills to for analysis, but the only one I knew is gone now.)

HOWEVER,

This is something a patient can learn about, and actually exert some control over.

What you need to do is learn who is manufacturing the generics you're taking. Generally, there's a 3-5 letter code on the printed label (examples: "BARR", "TEVA"). Keep a notebook and -write down- what you received (quantity, number of mg, # of times to take it per day, and especially, who made it.)

Write down when they work. Write down when they don't work. Be methodical about it. Written and computer records both work fine...

When it's obvious you've gotten a bad batch of generic meds, it's time to have a friendly chat with your pharmacist and just tell them, "Look, this generic from [whoever] isn't working, could we try some other manufacturer?"

Pharmacists aren't trying to shaft you, there's just no way for them to track a bazillion generic manufacturers, unless they hear, from you, that there's a problem. You need to be their feedback mechanism. Try to bear in mind that most pharmacists are being told in a big way to use inexpensive generics and to keep minimal stock onhand.

A pharmacist cannot take back a bad batch and swap you for a good batch, so don't even ask. But ask the pharmacist, "On your next refill, could we please go to another generic manufacturer"? In almost all cases, they'll be happy to. They don't like filling prescrips with junk.

Also keep communications open with your doctor, too. Doctors also can't keep track unless you help them. You've got to step up and take the responsibility for tracking what you get. This forum is a great step forward in this.

You must not go to your doc and say, "These suck, please give me a prescrip for either brand-name or at least a generic that's halfway okay". Doctors are being tracked by the DEA. Your name will pop up on a computer list of "early refills" if you refill early more than 3 times in any 6 month period (at least, that is my understanding). If that happens, your pharmacist, your doctor, probably the DEA, all get a letter that you may have a drug problem. (That happened to me because I was stocking up on refills for a long trip away from home. I had to go around and explain this to a bunch of people. Very tedious.)

As a quick for-example, I used to ask for "BARR" generics in what I take. They worked really well. Then "TEVA" bought out "BARR". Now TEVA's stuff is no more than 1/2 strength of what it should be, and it tastes different.

The brand-name cost is ridiculous.

With Our Benevolent Government handing out health and prescription insurance, you can bet your sweet bippy that some government MBA type is making lists of the cheapest generic manufacturers on the planet, and that's probably what you'll be forced to get. This will suck. As I said, American healthcare is in big trouble.

I hope this dissertation has helped you. Let me know if I can answer a question or two...

Thanks,
Smalls

If you look up who actually makes generics, you'll find a long list of foreign countries (India is very big on these). I've seen reports that "CARA" makes white-colored generics that don't work well. The white-colored "Watson" (I don't know their name code right off) are not getting happy reviews. The yellow colored ones work or don't work depending on who made them that day.

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I don't understand at all what this person is trying to say in English.

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Cvs is the only ones. That still have them. Check with them i have went everywhere.

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Flats.
MS Contin is time release and you need norcos or 15 mg Roxis for breakthrough pain. I hated the time release Oxycontin because they come on strong (hot flashes. uptightness, general wave of menapause syptoms) so I think it's better to get IR oxycodone so your pain is relieved without the unpleasantness of time release meds coming on when you don't need them and no relief whenyou do. Good luck. Jillady

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Unfortunately, my doctor wont prescribe anything stronger than Norco, so I manage. But, i don't like all the Tylenol in it...scares me what it is doing to my body. But, better to be out of pain, so I settle. I like my doctor, so I don't want to switch. Maybe she will change her mind about other pain meds.

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Yes. Sam's Club is awesome. I got switched to 20 mg. oxycodone and of course no pharmacy in town had it in stock except Sam's Club. My ID was expired, so the cashier said I could not get them. but the pharmacist was cool and told her to go ahead and process the order. For everyone on pain management I suggest you ask your doctor to switch you to oxycodone without tylenol. It has much better pain relief no matter what company it comes from. Good Luck!

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The most helpful answer I have found is that the generic brands may contain alternate binders, which mean they release into your system much more rapidly, making them not last as long. By law, they all have the exact same strength opioid. It actually makes sense!!

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tell your doctor that you are concerned about all the acetaminophen your taking, it's very hard on your liver and ask him about compounded pain meds. straight oxy or hydrocodone with no acetaminophen. works sooo much better.

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something to consider is that different injuries cause different pain. I broke 4 discs during pregnancy and for fifteen years I went through all the hoops. had two steroid epidermal injections and was taking 15mg Percocet, 4 x daily. my point is that I am always in pain from my back but when I had 47 stitches on my hand, 10mg would stop pain. nerve pain is so much harder to treat. ask your doctor to get you a tens unit for home. core strengthening is the best for disc and back pain. shot of torodol helps me when I cant walk or move.

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