Are Pdocs Currently Using Ketamine For Treatment Resistant Major Depressive Disorder? (Page 2)
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I know this is in the clinical trial phase to some degree but have been reading about people who have seen their doc for a ketamine infusion or nasal spray for treatment resistant Major Depressive Disorder (MDD).

I guess what I don't understand is if the clinical trials are only to learn how ketamine rapidly produces positive effects on people like myself, who've been treated for many years with many drugs and never found anything to relieve my MDD.

Does anyone know where I can find a doctor in my state, AZ? I saw a list in the Ketammine for Depression forums of doctors who use it for depression but I can't afford to drop in to UCLA Medical center for a shot at treatment.

My MDD has lasted over 20 years with very short (6 week) remissions. The past 6 years I've had no remission at all and the situation has reached a critical point.

To make matters worse, I've exhausted every financial resource I had over the past 18 years on finding a medication that helped. All to no avail.

Now I have no resources outside my state (state insurance won't cover me if I'm traveling), they don't cover Ketamine for depression, and I haven't been able to work for so long, I don't have a way to earn any money for treatment much less the basics like housing.

And, no I don't collect disability because I never worked enough credit hours to pay into the Social Security system. I applied for SSI but was denied & told I should seek the help of a professional in that field to reapply. But again, I spent almost $100,000 over 15 years seeking help and am no better today than the day I first set out to get better.

The reason I ask about Ketamine is because I've spoken to the NIMH about their study and read the study results up to this point & was impressed with a 71% success rate providing some or all relief from MDD symptoms. The research seems to show the frontal cortex of the brain which is slowly damaged if a person suffers with untreated MDD for extended periods of time; MAY SHOW a reversal of that damage when Ketamine is given. That is a study still in progress so that statement is to be taken as hopeful but not proven medical fact until the study releases it.

Lastly, I want to mention I am NOT advocating the illegal "club" drug Ketamine one might buy on the street. This form of Ketamine has been altered and is typically infused or used via Nasal Spray.
Buying Ketamine without a doctors prescription is against US law as well as many other countries laws.

The street Ketamine causes horrible side effects that can kill or permanently damage the human body. The way the study & psychiatric Ketamine was explained to me, it is not made the same way the street drug is and therefore received FDA approval for clinical trial on humans in the US.

If you are like me and suffer the most severe type of MDD, please do not try to use this drug without a doctors supervision, not only can you die, but even scarier to me, the MDD may get even worse.

Any idea of how to Google search for AZ doctors who use it for MDD (not pain as it's not my chief complaint) please advise!
I've searched for hours and all I can find is a couple pain clinics and clinical trials.

I'll find a way to pay for it but travel to CA is not an option even though it's only 5 hours by car.

Thanks for your help!!

After having tried 78 medications, 5 doctors, and 7 counselors, I'm at the end of the line. Can't live with this anymore & personally I don't feel I should have to. Thanks.

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Also, any other shrinks that are interested in starting a Ketamine for depression clinic in the DC area, let me know. It has 2 B a No insurance accepted practice. We will need a ANES MD or CRNA, infusion RN and psychiatrist. It will be a team approach.

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I am a clinician thinking about starting a clinic in the Washington DC area. I am curious how much demand there is here for a clinic that offers novel interventions for treatment resistant depression. This might include ketamine infusions , scopolamine, trans magnetic stimulation, etc. Please provide feedback as to whether there is a significant demand for these services. I will remain anonymous at this point.

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Hi Paula,
I'm so glad to hear that ketamine worked for you and that you've perhaps found a pdoc who will prescribe it for you. My pdoc also won't prescribe it; she doesn't know if it'll work (which I truly believe it will--I also come from an alcoholic family: father, mother, brothers, uncles, aunts). Could you possibly message me or email the name of that doctor? They're like finding diamonds.

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Paula,
Would you be able to provide me with the name and contact info for the 'open-minded psychiatrist' to whom you refer?
Thanks.

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Hi, i went to new york had 5 ketamine infussions spent over $2,000 and it didn't work :( it does seem to work for alot of people.dr said if it worked he was going to put me on a compounding dextromethorphan. You might want to look into this ,probally alot cheaper.good luck to you.

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Search the web for arizona ketamine depression treatment - there are options available

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Ketamine appears to work by raising intracellular magnesium levels in the central nervous system. Most with depression have low RBC magnesium levels. Try taking magnesium. That is cheap! Try slow mag from the pharmacy, or something that is enteric coated to make it through the stomach. Life Extension offers a new form of magnesium that can penetrate the Blood Brain Barrier. Most magnesium doesn't get through very well so you have to take a log. Try Epsom Salt baths also. That is magnesium salt and you absorb a lot through your skin. Good luck!

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There is a place that just opened up in Scottsdale that does ketamine infusions. It's called Depression Recovery Centers. They were on the news recently. They have to have an anesthesiologist administer it in a clinical setting with a nurse in an outpatient setting so it isn't cheap, but it is close by and may be worth the price if you are suffering horribly and can find the money... Looks like they've had success treating people with MDD and PTSD too.

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There is a place that just opened up in Scottsdale that does ketamine infusions. It's called Depression Recovery Centers. They were on the news recently. They have to have an anesthesiologist administer it in a clinical setting with a nurse in an outpatient setting so it isn't cheap, but it is close by and may be worth the price if you are suffering horribly and can find the money... Looks like they've had success treating a bunch of people. Best of luck to you.

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A doctor in Santa Barbara, CA, Dr. Terrence Early, does IM shots of Ketamine as an office visit and has treated 400 patients with about a 70% success rate. He gives .5 mg/kilo. He says nasal sprays don't work quite as well because only 30% of it is absorbed, but they work for some patients.
ipasb.com/ketamine-project
Also the Brain-Mind Institute of New England administers ketamine.
brainmindinstitute.com
A new Mayo Clinic study reported that serial infusions of a low dose (.5mg/kilo) works better than single infusions of a high dose. Here is the abstract:

Serial infusions of low-dose ketamine for major depression

Background: Single infusions of ketamine have been used successfully to achieve improvement in depressed patients. Side effects during the infusions have been common. It is not known whether serial infusions or lower infusion rates result in greater efficacy.
Methods: Ten depressed patients were treated with twice weekly ketamine infusions of ketamine 0.5 mg/kg administered over 100 min until either remission was achieved or four infusions were given. Side effects were assessed with the Young Mania Rating Scale (YMRS) and the Brief Psychiatric Rating Scale (BPRS). Patients were followed naturalistically at weekly intervals for four weeks after completion of the infusions.
Results: Five of 10 patients achieved remission status. There were no significant increases on the BPRS or YMRS. Two of the remitting patients sustained their improvement throughout the four week follow-up period.
Conclusions: Ketamine infusions at a lower rate than previously reported have demonstrated similar efficacy and excellent tolerability and may be more practically available for routine clinical care. Serial ketamine infusions appear to be more effective than a single infusion. Further research to test relapse prevention strategies with continuation ketamine infusions is indicated.

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There is a new clinic just opened in AZ. Called DRC. They have already treated a dozen or so patients and have gotten great results. Not cheap, but good to get a life back!

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I wish you all the luck. I am almost 40 and suffered from MDD since I was 12 years old so I feel your pain. I have been diagnosed, misdiagnosed, medicated, mis medicated for years. I have been on every drug known to man. I tried TMS Transcranial Magnetic Stimulation. Super expensive not covered by insurance yet, but it gets rave reviews. I did it for I think 6-8 weeks, lifted the suicidal tendencies but the underlying depression never went away. And my medical debt went up another 6 grand. I live on disability from a car accident that was not my fault, been through 20 surgeries plus and will prob need shots, epidurals and much more surgery down the road. I'm doing Ketamine now, been through 4 injections and I have spiraled downwards even worse. It's an 8 week course of action. I didn't snap up I snapped down severely, researching peaceful suicides and found 2. Very difficult to come by. Like have to travel to places I never knew existed. I am at the end of my rope as well. I'm in so much medical debt it's like I have no I insurance at all. The accident was workers comp. But there is hope because I was born with a chemical imbalance so my brain will probably even reject shock therapy. Nothing works for me but I bet you would benefit from it. Know it's frustrating because no matter how much you work, you feel you are always behind. I do have a home based biz that has changed my pain and it's basically ground floor to being in Apple before it went viral. I'm actually moving to Arizona to start teams out there. A good friend of mine was in a similar company called NuSkin and made 90 grand a month. So keep your chin up. I fight jumping off a bridge everyday. If there was someway to get you in the biz - I can promise you financially it will change your life forever. Rags to Riches. I'm in that category but no amount of money will ever cure me or alleviate the pain and surgeries. It's 4 years to retirement. Keep in touch. I can be reached at {edited for privacy}

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jackiesgone,
Oh man you are speaking volumes to me right now. Do you still check this blog for comments? I hope you know I am impressed with your journey, it is reminder that strong people are out there battling this as long and hard as I. THANK YOU, I'd like to talk with you about access to ketamine and other TRD interventions.
If you read this and want to network about this effort, please write. best of luck to you
Waterboy

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In reading some of your stories I did not see that anyone of you that tried or heard of K also used an anti deprs in addition to the K treatment. That was one of the first things that I discussed with my doc. I would continue my pills during the K treatment and after the 7 to 17 weeks of K, I would continue on with the pills. That should be part of the treatment.

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Have you looked into ECT? Extreme yes, but could be an option. I am starting my Ketamine treatment next week at the Summt Research center in Portland Or. My doc felt like I was not at the ECT point yet that I still had other options. Find a place where you can be part of their research. I have dealt with depssr all my life and last year lost my 10 yr old lil girl. That sent me over the top. I am desperate at this point. I have not been able to go back to work sense. I have never not worked. I was a single mom. Now I have nothing. So I need to find my relief somewhere. I am trying the Intravenous Ketamine. So we will see what kind of results I will get. It's Ketamine with my reg everyday meds. I can't take placebos. Can't risk it. I hope you find help soon.

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Ketamine infusions have made a huge change in my life. There is a doctor in New York City. His name is Glen Brooks and he charges only $480.00 per infusion. The amount given is based on your weight. He gives it over a 45 minute time period and you rest afterward. I got the best resuts receiving three infusions, one every other day. A doctor in Princeton recommends every other day, with 6 treatments over a 12 day period. I believe that (6) is the best way to do it. Dr. Brooks will do three infusions over 5 days but if you see him, I strongly urge you to do it every other day. Some people receive an anti-anxiety with the ketamine to cut back on the hallucinations but I found that it did not help my depression when it was included. Now, I go every three weeks for one infusion and it works. The weight lifted, the fog left, I can think clearly and have the desire to live again. I am no longer attached to my bed. I have suffered for over 30 years and have been on every single medication , including electric shock therapy.
Google, Dr Glen Brooks Ketamine NYC and call the number.

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Please, I beg you, do not recommend ECT to anyone. ECT nearly destroyed my life. I am a Yale graduate and had my ECT performed at Yale (along with some aging professors). This is the scam: You are anesthetized. You are shocked while under. You awake with a headache and with your memory in tatters. A loved-one takes you home and you spend a couple of days in a haze b/c of the aneshthesia and the shock. After 3 or so days, you begin to come to your self again and realize that you feel no better. In fact, you may feel much worse since your brain is functional enough at that point for you to realize that there is a significant toll being taken on your memory and cognition, but you are told that it will work - eventually and to just stick with it, have faith, etc.... And guess what, right about the time you begin to awaken to these facts, you are scheduled for your next round of treatment.
There is NO scientific (that is, the gold standard for testing drugs and procedures) applied to this treatment. Its supposed efficacy is almost completely anecdotal. It may no longer break bones and require a diabetic coma for administration but I can assure you it is just as brutal a treatment as ever. I should point out that nurses and anesthesiologists make MASSIVE amounts of money from this procedure. They are able to treat scores, if not hundreds of patients per week, and they are paid as if they had assisted in surgery. There is no disincentive on the part of the medical establishment (since ECT is generally performed in a private lab or section of the hospital and is really quite hidden from the rest of what goes on - even in the psych ward. It is also seen as a last-ditch effort anyway and is, therefore, easy not to even take under consideration)
I want to point out that (in spite of the fact I used the term "medical establishment") I am in NO WAY against psychology, psychiatry, medication, etc.
ECT, however, qualifies as an evil. I do not mean to say that anesthesiologists and nurses knowingly inflict an evil upon you when they administer this "therapy". They should, however, be scolded for their laziness and unwillingness to do their homework and see if there is any justifiable science behind the practice.
I went, against my psychiatrist's advice to have this treatment done. It has been 3 years. My ability to hold down a job is nil as both my long and short term memory is trashed. I have raise 3 wonderful boys. It's a good thing we took pictures b/c I have lost half of my memory of that experience - The most important, rewarding, wonderful experience of my life.
Avoid ECT as you would Ebola.

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I have done a quite a bit of research on these types of sites, if a pdoc won't cooperate, well I don't plan to endure 10 more years of HORRIBLE SUFFERING when I have already had the medication that CURED ME! Big Pharma doesn't give a DAMN about suffering, they care about lining THEIR pockets!!! F**k THEM! I will do what I have to do, if LE wants to punish an impoverished mentally ill woman trying to become a productive member of society like I once was, someone who has nothing and no one to lose, I am already in prison!

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Yes, had thyroid and hormones checked, have been placed on thyroid med to give more energy, hormones just proved that my ovaries are dead. But do want to check out if any hormone therapy could be helpful.

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To JackiesGone: have you ever tried ECT? It's a lot safer and more refined now than 50 years ago. Some permanent memory loss is possible, but it can be very effective for treating people with treatment resistant depression. Some studies show that at least 50% of TRD patients who do ECT go into remission. If you're desperate, I would definitely consider that and find a very good doctor and clinic that administers it. There's a lot variability in ECT clinics, so do your research and find a good one. IV Ketamine is indeed a hassle and expensive. If that is impossible, then you could try to get a doctor to prescribe intranasal ketamine. Compound pharmacies that specialize in making specific treatments like this can and have made sprays for ketamine. They'd mail you the spray, so you could do it from home. It may not be as effective as IV ketamine, but it has worked for some people and is worth a try. It's also safer, and so a doctor may be more willing to prescribe it. You could also consider a clinical trial with Alkermes new drug, ALKS-5461. clinicaltrials.gov/ct2/show/study/NCT01500200?show_locs=Y#locn

Brian- it's far from ideal but you could try checking zoklet, bluelight, or drugs forums for people who use ketamine illicitly. A few of them do use it for depression and may have the most experience at using this stuff long term.

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