New White Watson 853 10/325 Problem - What Is Going On!? (Page 4)

Hello all, I am a longtime chronic pain sufferer. I have taken opiates for pain for over 10 years. I recently got a prescription filled (from a well known pharmacy chain in the U.S.) and I was given these new Watson 853 white (not yellow) hydro 10/325 pills. I wanted to ask the forum here if any of you have had the same experience with them as I have. I know there are some very smart people with advanced chemistry knowledge here that may have delved deeper into whats going on with these things. They are ineffective for me. I've taken hydrocodone 10/325 for 10+ years and have never ever had a problem with pills being ineffective but that is the case with these pills. I've had about every brand you can think of and never an issue. Ever. I thought nothing of the color change when I got the pills home from the pharmacy... I've had the yellow Watson 853's before and figured they just changed the coloring. I've seen people complain before about differences in brands before, but I've never experienced anything like that.... Mallies, Watson, Qualitst... all the same to me. I didn't start looking around for answers until I noticed these pills were not working well at all. Something is 100% wrong. Based on some initial research I do see that they have taken the yellow dye out but there are other reports from people with the same issues as I see. Obviously you just don't know how reputable some of these reports are... I've seen posts talk about pharmacists telling the patient that the pills now are structured to release hydrocodone slower (even though its an IR pill... what?)... that Actavis/Watson employees have claimed there could be "kinetic imbalances" in their formulation when upset customers have called them... etc. The only truth I know is that there is something amiss with these things. Any response would be appreciated from you guys.... experiences/info/links to other similar reports, etc. This is the most frustrating thing I have ever run into and it just doesn't make much sense to me at the moment with whats going on....and the implications this could have if these pills have been truly altered by the manufacturer in some way. I know it doesn't mean much to just say it on an internet forum, but I'm not the type to cry wolf over something like this. I realize it could be a bad batch I've received, but it looks initially like the problem is more widespread. TIA for any responses to this thread! I came here because I believe this site has people that have the intelligence/knowledge to get to the bottom of it. Again, any info at all in relation to this would be appreciated greatly.

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queeniek, the yellow tablets are generic for brand name Vicodin. Frankly, I'm not sure if there is even a Brand Name Norco, Vicodin or Lortab. All of these are combination hydrocodone and acetaminophen. Insurance rarely pays for Brand Name drugs when there are as many different companies that make drug as their are that make this one.

One of the reasons Brand Name drugs are often better than Generic Drugs is because even though the active ingredients have to be the same. if a Brand.says it has 10 mg hydrocodone in it, it has 10 mg. If a Generic says it has 10 mg hydrocodone, it can have 8 mg-12 mg hydrocodone in it. And in the last few years it seems to have been on the lower scale. A Brand won't be the same as a Generic because the inactive ingredients are Not the same and that can affect how the med is absorbed.

You can ask your Dr to prescribe you Brand. On a prescription there is a place for the Dr to put or chose one of the following, Selection Not Permitted, No Substitutions Allowed, Dispense As Written, Brand Name Medically Indicated. For insurance to maybe pay for a brand name, the Dr has to do extra paperwork for Prior Authorization and insurance companies require the generics be tried first and they have to accept the reason the generic didn't work and brand is needed. The cost of a Brand drug is much more than the generic. If a prescription bottle says a med is Hydrocodone. 10 mg/Acetaminophen. 325 mg. Generic for Norco, the med is Not Brand Norco.

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PLEASE PLEASE someone respond to this and the prior post I put up!! I just picked up my script for another 120 Norco- drove by 3 pharmacies and 2 of them just straight shut me down when they found out I was looking for brand specific-'Qualitest'. Honestly .... I am at my wits end. The 3rc pharmacy I went to, I noticed Qualitest products on their shelves. I simply told the lady that I did not want to fill my prescription if they carried Millkrofot (misspell). She said they don't but I am a few days early, so I left. I have an appointment with my pain management dr @11am to talk with him about my concerns & issues with this damn medication ----how I feel that Watson & Millkrofot do not work for me, how I want brand specific. I am going to ask for either Qualitest or name brand Norco. Can anyone give me any feedback on name brand Norco? I have never taken them. Or can anyone give me any advice on how to approach this conversation with my dr. I have had the same pain management dr since 2009. I have followed everything he has ask of me, never faltered. Advice please- before 11am 10-07-2015

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queeniek, I don't believe they make the Brand Norco any more. All of the manufacturers I've found make the generic. Watson sold to another company a while back and I haven't read anything positive about the hydrocodone/acetaminophen that company makes.

I hope you were able to get a brand that works for you.

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The 1st Watson 853 I took did not lower my pain level at all. When the 2nd pill also had no effect I knew something was wrong with this formulation. After a Google search I found so many other similar experiences. I called Actavis to see if they had an explanation, and should hear back from them today. I have been taking hydrocarbon for 10 years and never had a problem. Oxycodone makes it harder to sleep and harder to urinate, so that's not a good substitute. Now what? Insurance won't pay for another script right now for more of this class of drugs. This is a serious problem.

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Well... I finally had enough. I picked up my script for Norco... Went to 4 different pharmacies, dinky asking to have my script filled (I also take Methadone & had that script too) and asking what company/brand did they carry of Norco b4 filling my script. I got met with the same 'about stop, oh you want a certain brand, she 's a drug addict look'.... At all 4 pharmacies. By the 4th I was in tears- and simply DONE! I drove back to my dr office- couldn't get in rt then, but seen him the next day.

I sat down with my Dr and told him what was happening, how it was making me feel, how these people were so horrible & ignorant, the multiple places I had enquirers etc. He simply looked at me and told me I didn't not need to go through this.. Made me feel like a i**** for waiting for so long but happy that he was open minded and trusted in my word and his patient. I also handed him 3/4 of a bottle of white Norco's- told him I don't want this useless medication. I'd rather not take it cause it doesn't work. White do not work - PERIOD. He simply said he is changing - he has put me on Oxycodon but 7.5 (I was on 325/10 Norco) because they are stronger. He said they too are an IR medication. I have never taken this medication but I am willing to try. All I know is I won't have to go through the humiliation that these pharmacies & their techs decide they want to throw on people who r really in need of pain medication because we ask for a certain brand that works for us-no more.

Wish me luck on the new medication! Any feed back? Anything I should know? Also thanks for all the help through my Norco nightmare!

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Qualitest works in 45 minutes, white 10-325 Mallinkrodt takes 2 hrs, lasts 1 and 1/2 hours. What in the world is going on here.

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queeniek, im glad you.got another med. Oxycodone is stronger than hydrocodone. Let us know how it works.

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I have been at it about the same amount of time, I took the big green watsons 10/750 at first these white ones didn't seem to work then I used a Tylenol 325 with it.. As time went on I just got used to the new ones. Don't double up. I tried that to.. You will get used to them, with me I think it was all in my head! It's not easy at first, I used icy hots.. 2-3 hot showers a day, slow stretching. But now I'm good, Texas wants to get rid of pain pills every month.... Hope I helped??

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How can they get away with this, is it our government controlling another part of the lives of Americans. I have so much pain in neck, back, legs and hands don't know what going to happen.

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You are not alone. I remain shocked that this has gone on for as long as it has . You would think the pharmacists would be behind the patient and forcing a change . The only Narco that works at all for me and my mom (both surgery related injuries) is by Qualitest.
I can tell you there is definitely something going on between big pharma and the government.

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It's alot more than just Norco that has been messed up... They only care about drug addicts getting high and have absolutely no problem letting legitimately suffering people suffer. Only in America do drug addicts have a higher priority than people suffering in pain! This is just further proof of how out of control our government has become in our lives and we all know all to well when the government gets involved in anything it's always a certifiable nightmare for the innocent!

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I agree with everything said. I myself just reached my breaking point. Sitting down with my Dr and having this discussion was the best thing I could have and did do. I no longer have to deal with the medication that doesn't work nor (most importantly) I do not have to deal with the ignorance that comes from these pharmacy's when trying to inquire on which brand of Norco do they carry. Over and done... It is simply horrible the way it all has transpired.
My dr switched my meds to Oxycodon and I am happy. You know why???? I am not in pain:) For that, I am greatful.
I hope that whatever is going on between our government & FDA... Whom ever- I hope the focus can return to the patient who is really in need of medication that works. Quit focusing on the drug addicts- worry about those who matter

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Safeway has the yellow ones. This is a legal suit if you ask me

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l too have taken the same pills. your first are sold at cvs. the Watson you speak of is junk, sold at walgreens. the answer of batch imbalance may be true. did you look to see where they were made? its unfortunate but any thing made outside this country is JUNK, walgreens product is!!!

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I believe Watson was bought by another company a while back but still has the Watson name.

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I feel your pain I was on hydro 10MIL for three years four times a day all it did was give me energy for 20 min then make me sleepy. I lowered my dosage to 7.5 to slowly get off for a month then went cold turkey I'm to young to be on meds for the rest of my life. I suffered the worst withdrawal ever I got rls the hot and cold sweats no sleep and attitude changes unfortunately I went back on so I wouldn't have to deal with the withdrawal that did nothing but make my body crave more and more it is a very depressing situation I decided to go cold turkey again this time with no tapering off I changed my diet drink lots of water took vitamins and worked out twice a day for 30 minutes surprisingly I had no withdrawal symptoms actually compared to what I went through the time before it took about 6 days for the medicine to fully get out of my system going off of the medicine was the best thing I ever did I'm not dependent on any chemical to make my body function properly all these medicine companies want to do is get people hooked so they can start taking stronger meds every time a doctor write a prescription they get a 60% commission per prescription they really don't care about the health I am so glad it's very hard but I know you can do it

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Not sure if this helps but I been on atoz narcotics an non narcotics. I'm in pain management which allowed my family doctor to write my pain meds if he would by sending him a recommendation letter an he is certified to write anything I need but not suboxone an subutex so I been on high dose opiate's now for over 10years still am but a new doctor took over I went from 360 30mg Oxycodone ir up to 12in a 24hr period an 2 60mg oxycontin Er 1every 12hrs now she cut me down to 120 15mg Oxycodone ir 4aday an 60 20mg oxycontin 2aday an I have not been right since in pain now an stay sick all day everyday so the high doses for so long has messed my mind an my body up an there is nothing I can do about it cause every time I try to get off the opiate's I have tried cold turkey suboxone tablets an strips 16mg of subutex a day I stay sick an have bad scary hallucinations an I tell my fiance an dad all these real life events that is going on an I find out later after getting put in the hospital takes about 2 weeks to come back to earth that everything I thought an was like living it is so life like was not even real I always have to get put back on my pain meds or go crazy an this past time I stopped an in 9days I went from 145lbs to 95lbs an would have died if I had not got back on the pain meds all it would have took was couple more days an I would not be here so I told the doctor that took over I needed to have my meds fixed back like they was for 10yrs an she said if I ask again she is taking it all away an I'm disabled since age 22 I'm now 38 an have legitimate reason to be on them from a spine doctor an pain management all from UVA in Charlottesville Virginia put me on the rest of my life so that puts me in a hell of a situation an few days back I here from the doctor an they are saying that they can prescribe medications for pain an they not sure why but the pharmacy's are refusing to fill legitimate prescriptions an the doctors said its nothing they can do about that so I hope nobody goes thru this kinda hell I'm going thru. I also thought I'd ask a doctor a question online on maybe trying medical cannabis to get off the opiate's an he replied back to me saying I'm just another junkie looking to feel high and its not true. I've never been in trouble for abusing my meds an I don't sell them. I need them for pain and I am co dependant on my meds as I guess they help some, but addict I'm not. I thought that was wrong also but to all good luck.

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Ken, you won't find a dr that will put you back on that high dose. Drs are now going by the FDA Guidelines of 120 mg Morphine/Morphine Equivalent Daily. And there are plans in motion for the 120 mg to be reduced to 90 mg.

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I have been told by the nurses at the doctors office I been at since I was born that I'm supposed to call my doctor office 5days before I run out an I did they tried to say I was calling in to early I said well you need to tell the nurse that said call in ahead of time at first they looked down at me until I got it straight once they learned one of there own told me to it was all okay then I had been getting shorted a few times on my pain meds at my pharmacy an they told me at my doctors office to ask an look at what type pill they have before getting it filled an to count my meds in the pharmacy's before I leave as once you leave out the pharmacy's with the meds you can't go back in an tell them that there is some missing so I did what they told me an again I get looked as addict junkie then I tell them my doctors office told me to do all that everything was fine from then on now I get the right meds an amounts just not what I was on for 10plus years I'm just tired of all the bs they come up with while telling someone to do this an that an you do an they wanna call ppl junkie addict doctor shopping filling at more than one pharmacy wish I didn't need there meds I would have never took none if I knew then what I'm stuck in an on now

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This is a doctor speaking. The FDA working with some , not all pharmaceutical companies, to only change the wasted effect that the hydrocodone gives you. In double blind studies these new pills are just as effective at diminishing the pain as before, but the test subjects did not prefer these because they lost that, wasted effect. In these studies on a scale of 1 to 50, with 1 being the most effective pain killer and 50 the least effective. Vicoden rated 17 and Percocet 16. 2 200mg ibuprofen added to 1 500mg acetaminophen had a rating of 4. Only morphine, dilaudid and demerol were more effective pain killers than the Motrin/Tylenol combination. Better get used to it because vicodin and Percocet are the most abused pain medications in the world. Sorry to be the bearer of bad news for you.

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